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talldarkandgrusome

Joined: 5/15/2007

Quote: if you build a better mouse trap, dont tell al gore or he will claim it

 

Need a rules reference 5/14/2018 6:32:40 PM

During a recent game,my opponent thought that when Navigator's Compass Buy added a land type that the land now taps for both instead of one or the other. Can someone point me to the rules that explain otherwise?

 

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Mallys
Guru

Joined: 5/21/2004

Quote: [none]

 

RE: Need a rules reference 5/14/2018 7:36:22 PM

Quoting talldarkandgrusome:During a recent game,my opponent thought that when Navigator's Compass added a land type that the land now taps for both instead of one or the other. Can someone point me to the rules that explain otherwise?

There aren't many rules that say, "[thing] isn't allowed," or, "[thing] doesn't happen." The rules are generally more permissive than restrictive - that is, they tell you what you can do and when you can do it rather than telling you what you can't do or when you can't do it - you may cast a sorcery during your main phases whenever the stack is empty, rather than you can't cast a sorcery except during your main phases whenever the stack is empty. That said, there are a couple of rules that make this particular inference pretty straightforward.

Quoting CompRules:305.6. The basic land types are Plains, Island, Swamp, Mountain, and Forest. If an object uses the words “basic land type,” it’s referring to one of these subtypes. A land with a basic land type has the intrinsic ability “{T}: Add [mana symbol],” even if the text box doesn’t actually contain that text or the object has no text box. For Plains, [mana symbol] is {W}; for Islands, {U}; for Swamps, {B}; for Mountains, {R}; and for Forests, {G}. See rule 107.4a. See also rule 605, “Mana Abilities.”

305.7. If an effect sets a land’s subtype to one or more of the basic land types, the land no longer has its old land type. It loses all abilities generated from its rules text, its old land types, and any copy effects affecting that land, and it gains the appropriate mana ability for each new basic land type. Note that this doesn’t remove any abilities that were granted to the land by other effects. Setting a land’s subtype doesn’t add or remove any card types (such as creature) or supertypes (such as basic, legendary, and snow) the land may have. If a land gains one or more land types in addition to its own, it keeps its land types and rules text, and it gains the new land types and mana abilities.

As you can see, having a basic land type bestows a mana ability corresponding to it, and when a land is given a land type "in addition to" whatever it has, it gains that corresponding mana ability on top of its existing rules text. Note that the rules do not say anything about gaining a combined or improved mana ability - there is no rule that says a Forest gaining the mountain subtype has, ": Add {R}{G}."

This is probably the best argument you're going to find for your side (which is correct). If the player in question remains unconvinced, challenge them to find support for their side in the rules themselves.
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Comprehensive Rules --- Gatherer --- Tournament Rules

 

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norrock

Joined: 1/29/2009

Quote: "Easy for you to say."

 

RE: RE: Need a rules reference 5/15/2018 12:19:12 AM

Is there a more general rule pertaining to permanents in general in regards to what happens when a permanent gains an extra tap ability in addition to one it has already?

 

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Mallys
Guru

Joined: 5/21/2004

Quote: [none]

 

RE: RE: RE: Need a rules reference 5/15/2018 1:16:11 AM

Quoting norrock:Is there a more general rule pertaining to permanents in general in regards to what happens when a permanent gains an extra tap ability in addition to one it has already?

Not really. There isn't anything particularly interesting that should happen - the permanent just has another ability. You could choose to activate one ability and tap the permanent for that, or you could choose to activate a different ability and tap it for that one. You won't be able to tap it and activate both abilities simultaneously.

If you have a more specific question, that might help in figuring out what answer you're looking for.
--------------------
Comprehensive Rules --- Gatherer --- Tournament Rules

 

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norrock

Joined: 1/29/2009

Quote: "Easy for you to say."

 

RE: RE: RE: RE: Need a rules reference 5/15/2018 1:38:31 AM

The above question that started the thread is actually my question. Talldarkandgruesome (a personal friend of mine) posted it for me. This is actually the first time in years I've logged into EM. Surprised I remembered my loggin info lol

 

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norrock

Joined: 1/29/2009

Quote: "Easy for you to say."

 

RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Need a rules reference 5/15/2018 1:49:31 AM

Gruesome is my go to for rules questions. EM is one if his go tos lol

 

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